The Case as of Today - Posted by Coldwater on DM

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The Case as of Today - Posted by Coldwater on DM

Postby bjr » Thu Jan 03, 2008 7:31 pm

Hello everybody.

I've been dabbling with my sources again and thought you might all like to hear the distilled information they have imparted to me - (that which I can reveal, obviously).

Firstly I think it important to say that this investigation is nowhere near closure. As many will know, charges will only arrive when the investigation is officially at an end and not before.

Right now the investigation is focusing on May 2nd 10.00pm through to around 10.00pm May 3rd - a 24hr period in which it is now considered several crimes were committed.

The shift in emphasis to May 2nd is primarily due to the significant lack of independent evidence to support Maddy being seen alive during May 3rd by anyone outside of the TAPAS 9 - and even then only Oldfield actually 'saw' her. Maddy was not present at the creche or children's club. She did not eat with the others and there is NO CCTV footage of her anywhere in the complex or PDL at large beyond the afternoon of May 2nd.

It is also deemed of interest that Gerry missed his afternoon tennis session on May 3rd due to an 'Achilles' injury. It was his unannounced absence which actually drew Oldfield to the apartment and not Gerry asking him to check on Kate. Gerry was not present at the tennis courts and Oldfield went looking for him. Gerry was elsewhere entirely. It is now believed that Oldfield did NOT see Maddy during this brief visit.

The theory is now that Maddy died around midnight May 2nd and that her body was concealed in a bag - Gerry's lost/missing/never had one hold all, sports bag no less. It is believed that this bag was stored in another apartment during some part of May 3rd before initial disposal around the mid to late afternoon of May 3rd. The scent of death was well established and the clean up completed during this time frame. The apartment's cleaner was turned away on May 3rd by Kate McCann I am told.

The forensic material examined and the results are strong in places and weak in others. None are conclusive but highly indicative and along with other evidence form a persuasive case. It is no longer considered that Maddy's body was relocated using the Renault Scenic, but that items pertaining to her and taken from her body were removed, hidden in the tyre well and dumped elsewhere.

As previously reported the PJ have the bag Gerry is so keen now to deny all knowledge of. It is a damning piece of the jigsaw, but not the only one and not the best.

CCTV footage from MW's reception proves that the TAPAS 9 were, for the most part, lying about the frequency of their checks. This is considered an attempt by ALL TAPAS 9 to stall any charges of negligence. The investigation team are also aware of the attempt within the May 3rd confusion to blur the actual time and circumstances of Maddy's disappearance.

They all did eat at Chaplin's on May 2nd and they were contacted at Chaplin's by an employee of MW's with regard to the children - specifically the McCann children. This was followed up immediately upon their return to the MW complex.

Further questioning is to take place shortly and will encompass ALL TAPAS 9 elements, plus others. It is now expected that two others will be made or allowed to request Arguido/Arguida status. These two others are seen as complicit in the aftermath of events surrounding Maddy.

Again, as far as my information allows, I can say that there is NO suggestion of pedophile involvement in any way. The DNA of a North European does not mean that this came from semen or that there is any suggestion of sexual abuse. I think we should all sigh with relief over that. There have been errors in translation and information which may have lead some down this murky pathway.

This case is not finished yet and has a way to run. The culprits will not be found in Spain, Portugal or Morocco.

The above has been gleaned and distilled over Christmas from my three friends and sources. I can elucidate on some points but not others.
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Postby CaptnMorgan » Thu Jan 03, 2008 7:38 pm

Thanks to Coldwater and thanks bjr for posting it over here!!

I'm glad to see that sexual abuse wasn't part of it. I feel relieved at that at least.
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Postby mercedes2 » Thu Jan 03, 2008 7:59 pm

They did dine at Chaplins on the 2nd...........................But didn't Bridget O'Donnell say she was at the next table that night in the Tapas :?:
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Postby pink_panther » Thu Jan 03, 2008 8:14 pm

I've just read that thread on DM. Very, very interesting read and very sobering. If it is true then how cold and callous were they to have sat and thought out their plan of action. It seems it was not a rushed plan at all, yet they still didn't cover all eventualities. I believe the CCTV footage and Gerry's sports bag could be the evidence to charge them.

I truly believe that if they have been so calculating I fear they will never reveal where the body of their daughter is. Shame on them.
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Postby keepingmum » Thu Jan 03, 2008 8:21 pm

Could they have dined at Chaplins and afterwards gone to the Tapas Bar - just for drinks and, of course, the quiz? Excellent post Coldwater.
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............

Postby mercedes2 » Thu Jan 03, 2008 8:24 pm

Yes, anything is possible, but with so many contradictions in press articles it is very hard to know what is fact or fiction.
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Postby dogrose » Thu Jan 03, 2008 8:29 pm

maybe they dined there and then went to Chaplins for a night cap? After all BO'D left because their kid woke up didnt they. So she doesnt know what they did afterwards. would have been plenty time to go on somewhere else after they had eaten at the Tapas.

out of all the theories this seems the most logical explanation of what happened. what is missing though is why they all covered it up, and for so long.
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Postby cassen » Fri Jan 04, 2008 8:17 am

On that same thread, Coldwater posted a bit later:
"What I posted is NOT my opinion or MY thoughts on the case. I posted what I was told by my friends/sources over the Christmas period.

As before we will have to wait and see how things pan out. I don't have access to any facts, but my sources do.

My own opinion was that the deed occured May 3rd - but I can see how May 2nd explains many things and ties them together.

I have also said that I could be wrong about Oldfield/Payne - I've emailed one of my sources for clarification.

I am willing to answer all questions where possible via pm if required, and without compromising my sources.

This is the current thrust of the case as I was told, and I was also told that it will not be wrapped up anytime soon. Questioning will take place within the next few weeks, despite what others have said."

As I pointed out on DM forum, I find it most paradoxal that Coldwater does not believe this version of the facts. My point is that Coldwater, who knows - as he says - more than what he's telling us, must have some very good reason not to believe his sources even if these sources have access to some facts which Coldwater ignores.
Personnally I think that the whole plot of the cover up of Madeleine's absence on the 3rd May is what makes him doubt his sources' version of the facts, as it does with some other posters, including myself.
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Postby PassingThru » Fri Jan 04, 2008 12:12 pm

If not paedophile involvement, why is government so heavily involved? This is not a simple accident case, there must be a lot more to it.
There will be NO justice for Madeleine, because all the questions that should have been asked are brushed under the Government carpet. There is no-one left, that dares anymore.

Madeleine who?
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Postby Brad1963 » Fri Jan 04, 2008 12:36 pm

Looks like Coldwater may be in the long line of attention seekers that seem to frequent the MF. They usually start by saying they have "deep throat" sources close to the investigation. This will be followed by predictions and most likely dates that will never materialise and be blamed on said sources. Why is it that people take what an anonymous forum member says as gospel while dispelling every piece of conjecture that doesn't fit into their viewpoint.

Very reminiscient of Sentimental Agent whose prophecies never materialised, followed by Logicman and Truth Me Lud, even Pixie (Tiny) has gotten in on the act recently. Guess it's the nature of the case, with no official news released Idle hands and all that.
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Postby MsMarbles » Fri Jan 04, 2008 12:44 pm

Brad1963 wrote:Looks like Coldwater may be in the long line of attention seekers that seem to frequent the MF. They usually start by saying they have "deep throat" sources close to the investigation. This will be followed by predictions and most likely dates that will never materialise and be blamed on said sources. Why is it that people take what an anonymous forum member says as gospel while dispelling every piece of conjecture that doesn't fit into their viewpoint.

Very reminiscient of Sentimental Agent whose prophecies never materialised, followed by Logicman and Truth Me Lud, even Pixie (Tiny) has gotten in on the act recently. Guess it's the nature of the case, with no official news released Idle hands and all that.


I don't think Coldwater is one of the attention seekers. I do however agree with some on there that there isn't much to be gleaned from what was posted up in the thread opening post that many hadn't already debated. I think maybe Coldwater does have sources, but they have told him nothing much new and Coldwater has made a sort of disclaimer that he/she does not know how much of it is true really, an attention seeker would hardly do that? They would be shouting it from the highest hills that it's true, and we can believe it or not, but we will see. Coldwater doesn't seem to do any of that.

If I am honest here, if some do have sources, I would rather they said nothing at all if the sources are going to give so little away about the case and what is expected to be happening. I get my hopes up not about K & G, but about movement in the case and hopefully justice for Madeleine then nothing, the case seems to stall again for a while. I will say honestly here I care not an iota about K & G McCann as people or whether it turns out they were instumental in their daughter Madeleine's disappearance or not, I find the them both very unlikeable people. I just care about justice for Madeleine, whether that come through the parents being charged or not.

I did however ask a question of Coldwater by pm, as he had suggested anyone could if they wished to. The reply that I got was sort of what I expected, but gave me no more insight into what I wished to know.
Last edited by MsMarbles on Fri Jan 04, 2008 12:51 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby Brad1963 » Fri Jan 04, 2008 12:48 pm

MsMarbles wrote:
Brad1963 wrote:Looks like Coldwater may be in the long line of attention seekers that seem to frequent the MF. They usually start by saying they have "deep throat" sources close to the investigation. This will be followed by predictions and most likely dates that will never materialise and be blamed on said sources. Why is it that people take what an anonymous forum member says as gospel while dispelling every piece of conjecture that doesn't fit into their viewpoint.

Very reminiscient of Sentimental Agent whose prophecies never materialised, followed by Logicman and Truth Me Lud, even Pixie (Tiny) has gotten in on the act recently. Guess it's the nature of the case, with no official news released Idle hands and all that.


I don't think Coldwater is one of the attention seekers. I do however agree with some on there that there isn't much to be gleaned from what was posted up in the thread opening post that many hadn't already debated. I think maybe Coldwater does have sources, but they have told him nothing much new and Coldwater has made a sort of disclaimer that he/she does not know how much of it is true really, an attention seeker would hardly do that? They would be shouting it from the hif=ghest hills that it's true, and we can believe it or not, but we will see. Coldwater doesn't seem to do any of that.

I did however ask a question of Coldwater by pm, as he had suggested anyone could if they wished to. The answer was I got was sort of what I expected, but gave me no more insight into what I wished to know.


IMO he is quite a sophisticated attention seeker. I'm just waiting for dates to be given and prophecies to be made. Watch this space.
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Postby blacksmith » Fri Jan 04, 2008 1:03 pm

I refer to Coldwater's original post. He talks of having "sources". Such sources are either outside the investigating authority and, as such, worthless as evidence to what that authority, the PJ, are doing; or they are within the PJ. Coldwater does not have sources within the PJ.

"Right now the investigation is focusing on May 2nd 10.00pm through to around 10.00pm May 3rd - a 24hr period in which it is now considered several crimes were committed."

This is not correct. 10.PM on May 2 was chosen by the PJ as the start point for intensive study of events in PDL at the beginning of the investigation many months ago. It has not changed in any way recently.

"The shift in emphasis to May 2nd is primarily due"

This is incorrect. There has been no recent shift in emphasis to May 2.

"the significant lack of independent evidence to support Maddy being seen alive during May 3rd by anyone outside of the TAPAS 9 - and even then only Oldfield actually 'saw' her. Maddy was not present at the creche or children's club. She did not eat with the others and there is NO CCTV footage of her anywhere in the complex or PDL at large beyond the afternoon of May 2nd."

This is incorrect. "Independent" can only mean independent of the perpetrators of the crime and possible accomplices. There is independent evidence.

"The theory is now that Maddy died around midnight May 2nd and that her body was concealed in a bag."

This is incorrect. It is not "the theory". There is no one theory and death at midnight on May 2 is not among the working theories. Coldwater has been misled by his "sources."

"Again, as far as my information allows, I can say that there is NO suggestion of paedophile involvement in any way."

This is incorrect. The PJ have actively considered – and have not discounted – paedophile activity by one of the Tapas 9.

Such a large number of factually incorrect statements mean that the posting is not reliable.

Sorry.
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Postby Brad1963 » Fri Jan 04, 2008 1:09 pm

http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache:IG ... d=87&gl=uk

Interesting post from Coldwater. His style is very familiar. :wink:
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Postby MsMarbles » Fri Jan 04, 2008 1:43 pm

You have lost me on that one Brad? :? Who's posting style is it like?

However it has craftily led me nicely into asking a question of yourself I have been wanting to ask for a while ;) Do you post on the Madeleine thread on Digital Spy? Not as a regular, but to you post on there, as your posting style looks very familar to a poster's on there and it got me wondering. If you don't wish to, don't feel obliged to tell me if you do post there and who you be, I am just being nosey ;) I post on there as Susann.
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