Eddie and Keela working

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Eddie and Keela working

Postby Impartial » Thu May 29, 2008 2:01 pm

Read and weep (especially Philomena and the anti-dog liga)

States Of Jersey Police
PRESS RELEASE
Wednesday, 28 May 2008

http://www.jersey.police.uk/pdf-files/H ... 280508.pdf

The Enhanced Victim Recovery Dog (EVRD) 'Eddie' was deployed in a wide area screening capacity within the outer boundaries of the HDLG with no alert indications or behaviour changes evident. The search was recorded via GPS data logging equipment attached to the dog's collar to ensure complete area coverage.

Geophysical anomalies identified by other assets, were probed and subjected to EVRD screening. No alert indications were forthcoming. A large amount of animal bone historically deposited in the grounds of Haut De La Garenne as refuse was ignored.

The EVRD was deployed tactically within the ground floor of the premises where a continuing alert indication of varying strength was given in the western aspect. The weakest being in the south-western corridor, the strongest and most significant being in the northwestern stairwell.

The reactions of the dog are explained as scent travelling through 'chimneys' such as conduit, electric cable ducting, which transects from the north west stairwell along the western corridor in a southerly direction.

Anecdotal witness evidence was suggestive of juvenile human bones being recovered from the area of the north-western stairwell during recent building renovations in 2003. Human remains deposited within the ground in that area would contaminate the ground, and any porous material within it. The dog's reactions were therefore consistent with this scenario. The area was therefore subjected to intrusive archaeological excavation. A fragment of what the forensic anthropologist describes as being possibly human juvenile skull was recovered from within a Victorian context of the excavation. The fragment was shipped to the U.K. for confirmation of substance, species, carbon dating and DNA testing. The laboratory conducting the analysis reported confused and conflicting findings therefore no conclusion is available at this time. Other burnt bone fragments were also recovered from the context within this area. The dating of the context is Victorian, outside the time spectrum of a homicide enquiry at this time.

The EVRD gave a number of alert indications in the eastern wing of the building. Holes were drilled through the 3 inch thick wooden / insulated clad flooring to allow the dog scent access to the voids below. He identified areas of interest which supported anecdotal witness evidence. This prompted the complete removal of the flooring in 2/3 of the east wing.

Removal of the flooring revealed the original ground floor of the building including a large brick and rendered bath, original sinks and toilet area. Renovations had enclosed the areas below the modern flooring which resembled 'cellars'.

The EVRD was again deployed in a detailed search of these areas. Alert indications were forthcoming which, where appropriate, were confirmed using 'Keela', the human blood search dog.

The EVRD alert indications were confirmed by intrusive archaeological excavation and sieving. A significant number of bone fragments and teeth have been recovered which have been corroborated as human both macroscopically and microscopically. The remains are at the present time undergoing forensic testing including carbon dating procedures. We have received various dating indicators which require clarification.

Three indications by the human blood search dog were given in cellar one which, when subjected to presumptive testing, proved positive.

Two indications by the human blood search dog were given in the cellar entrance hall which when subjected to presumptive testing proved positive.

The EVRD provided alert indications in support of the human blood search dog. Forensic samples were recovered and conveyed to the UK for further testing.
Other deployments of the EVRD were based upon the blind screening of soil samples and other areas from which suggestive intelligence is supported:
The EVRD was deployed to screen soil samples from certain contexts of archaeological excavation. A positive reaction was forthcoming from a context where it is reported possible human remains were uncovered and removed by builders in the area of the main electric feed in the north-western wing.

There is some witness evidence to suggest that these remains were also human juvenile. Although the remains were examined by a pathologist they were not positively species identified. In fact the pathologists report lists at least one bone that was 'UNIDENTIFIED'. Measurements of the bones would tend to suggest that they would have been consistent with being juvenile human.

It is important to note that a substantial amount of animal bone has been recovered from the site as a whole. The EVRD has ignored all such material whilst alerting to confirmed human remains. This tends to support the scenario above.

Both the EVRD and Human blood search dog are presumptive screening assets. Any alert indications must be forensically corroborated to be conclusive.
All my posts are based on the fact that Kate and Gerry were made arguidos - on suspicion of concealment of the corpse and simulation of the crime of abduction (JdN)
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Re: Eddie and Keela working

Postby fedrules » Thu May 29, 2008 2:06 pm

Thanks for posting this.It makes very interesting reading.However,here bones have been found to collaborate the alerts whereas in the McCann case,the forensic traces may be less incriminating.Still very significant though..
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Re: Eddie and Keela working

Postby DCB » Thu May 29, 2008 2:06 pm

"Both the EVRD and Human blood search dog are presumptive screening assets. Any alert indications must be forensically corroborated to be conclusive."

Relevant
On Saturday we asked the Portuguese police if they had any objection to us coming back to the UK. We had assured them that we will continue to cooperate fully with the investigation and of course will return as requested and for our own emotional reasons.
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Re: Eddie and Keela working

Postby jez » Thu May 29, 2008 2:10 pm

it does seem that if something smells like a duck...it's probably a duck.
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Re: Eddie and Keela working

Postby BrainFreeze » Thu May 29, 2008 2:12 pm

Relevant because Eddie ignored the bone fragments that were from animals....also relevant as it proves once again just how darned good this little dog is!
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Re: Eddie and Keela working

Postby DCB » Thu May 29, 2008 2:14 pm

BrainFreeze wrote:Relevant because Eddie ignored the bone fragments that were from animals....also relevant as it proves once again just how darned good this little dog is!


"Any alert indications must be forensically corroborated to be conclusive."
On Saturday we asked the Portuguese police if they had any objection to us coming back to the UK. We had assured them that we will continue to cooperate fully with the investigation and of course will return as requested and for our own emotional reasons.
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Re: Eddie and Keela working

Postby fedrules » Thu May 29, 2008 2:16 pm

Yes DCB,agree that the alerts on their own are not evidence,that's down to the FSS.
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Re: Eddie and Keela working

Postby DCB » Thu May 29, 2008 2:20 pm

fedrules wrote:Yes DCB,agree that the alerts on their own are not evidence,that's down to the FSS.


Thanks, but I was only quoting what I thought was the relevant part of the article.
On Saturday we asked the Portuguese police if they had any objection to us coming back to the UK. We had assured them that we will continue to cooperate fully with the investigation and of course will return as requested and for our own emotional reasons.
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Re: Eddie and Keela working

Postby grob » Thu May 29, 2008 2:22 pm

DCB wrote:
BrainFreeze wrote:Relevant because Eddie ignored the bone fragments that were from animals....also relevant as it proves once again just how darned good this little dog is!


"Any alert indications must be forensically corroborated to be conclusive."


As you are keen on repeating yourself I am going to repeat a post I made earlier today on another thread, A university study indicated that cadaver dogs are 98% accurate, 98% is pretty good but ...

Its better than that, one dog is 98% accurate which means they could be wrong 1/50 (1 time in 50), but they used two dogs so the chances of them both being wrong is 1/250. And better than that they found the scent in a number of places associated with the Mcanns, flat, car, Kate etc...

Lets say 3 places for arguments sake, the chances of both dogs being wrong 3 times is 1/15,625,000,000 or 99.99999999%, the chances of winning the lottery are 1/14,000,000 so you are 1000 times more likely to win the lottery than two dogs who are 98% accurate of both getting something wrong 3 times.

Of course 99.99999999% is still not conclusive but it does show where you should put your money if you were a betting man.
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Re: Eddie and Keela working

Postby fedrules » Thu May 29, 2008 2:25 pm

Yes Grob and when you add to that the unlikeliness of an abduction in such circumstances compared to parental involvement,the odds for the McCanns' innocence seem pretty poor.. :shock:
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Re: Eddie and Keela working

Postby scandi » Thu May 29, 2008 2:34 pm

DCB wrote:"Both the EVRD and Human blood search dog are presumptive screening assets. Any alert indications must be forensically corroborated to be conclusive."

Relevant



Hi DCB, ITA The alert indications the dogs give is chemical and can be tested and verified at the lab. I have read that info can be graphed, cross checked and is then considered court ready evidence. IMO

Everyone involved with Eddie and Keela in the case have kept most everything about them and how they work and how they verify what it is they have found almost completely under wraps. I think that is also relevant.

IMO Madeleine's case was extremely fortunate that Eddie and Keela were the dogs used. I did read in a link which I posted not that long ago that said Eddie is the first dog to sniff a death scent on items such as clothing. I would say very fortunate indeed. ;}


PS: Thanks Impartial for the thread.
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Re: Eddie and Keela working

Postby DCB » Thu May 29, 2008 2:35 pm

grob wrote:
DCB wrote:
BrainFreeze wrote:Relevant because Eddie ignored the bone fragments that were from animals....also relevant as it proves once again just how darned good this little dog is!


"Any alert indications must be forensically corroborated to be conclusive."


As you are keen on repeating yourself I am going to repeat a post I made earlier today on another thread, A university study indicated that cadaver dogs are 98% accurate, 98% is pretty good but ...

Its better than that, one dog is 98% accurate which means they could be wrong 1/50 (1 time in 50), but they used two dogs so the chances of them both being wrong is 1/250. And better than that they found the scent in a number of places associated with the Mcanns, flat, car, Kate etc...

Lets say 3 places for arguments sake, the chances of both dogs being wrong 3 times is 1/15,625,000,000 or 99.99999999%, the chances of winning the lottery are 1/14,000,000 so you are 1000 times more likely to win the lottery than two dogs who are 98% accurate of both getting something wrong 3 times.

Of course 99.99999999% is still not conclusive but it does show where you should put your money if you were a betting man.


I didn't repeat myself - I repeated an extract from the article. I will go on repeating it if necessary until the evidence is presented in court. I am not discounting the dogs indications - but they cannot give evidence in court - they are indicative only. Woof woof.
On Saturday we asked the Portuguese police if they had any objection to us coming back to the UK. We had assured them that we will continue to cooperate fully with the investigation and of course will return as requested and for our own emotional reasons.
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Re: Eddie and Keela working

Postby Impartial » Thu May 29, 2008 3:29 pm

There will be 2 kinds of evidence in court, the DNA evidence found due to the dogs alerting, and the handlers of Eddie and Keela will be giving witness evidence. It will be essential in order to determin the death of Madeleine. The DNA will have to show a certain percentage that it is from Madeleine. Other forensics will have to show that the fluids (or whatever was collected) came from a dead body. The dogs come in as an additional confirmation regarding the death. Their handlers evidence and the credibility of the dogs might make the difference between reasonable doubt and beyond reasonable doubt.

This thread was intended as belonging into the Justice for Madeleine Forum, since Eddie and Keela will play a major part in the forthcoming trial and this article was only cited to illustrate the way they work and how reliable especially these two have been.
All my posts are based on the fact that Kate and Gerry were made arguidos - on suspicion of concealment of the corpse and simulation of the crime of abduction (JdN)
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Re: Eddie and Keela working

Postby fedrules » Thu May 29, 2008 3:32 pm

Well,it certainly highlighted the dogs' efficiency.
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Re: Eddie and Keela working

Postby DCB » Thu May 29, 2008 3:36 pm

Impartial wrote:There will be 2 kinds of evidence in court, the DNA evidence found due to the dogs alerting, and the handlers of Eddie and Keela will be giving witness evidence. It will be essential in order to determin the death of Madeleine. The DNA will have to show a certain percentage that it is from Madeleine. Other forensics will have to show that the fluids (or whatever was collected) came from a dead body. The dogs come in as an additional confirmation regarding the death. Their handlers evidence and the credibility of the dogs might make the difference between reasonable doubt and beyond reasonable doubt.

This thread was intended as belonging into the Justice for Madeleine Forum, since Eddie and Keela will play a major part in the forthcoming trial and this article was only cited to illustrate the way they work and how reliable especially these two have been.


Acknowledged.
On Saturday we asked the Portuguese police if they had any objection to us coming back to the UK. We had assured them that we will continue to cooperate fully with the investigation and of course will return as requested and for our own emotional reasons.
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