21 steps to trial and secrecy of justice

Madeleine Beth McCann went missing from PDL in Portugal on the 3rd May 2007, there are so many unanswered questions, please discuss

Re: 21 steps to trial

Postby beachy » Tue Apr 29, 2008 6:42 pm

StinkySardine wrote:
Alpine Aster wrote:Hi Sardine and thank you for taking your time to write this.

Do you think the McCann's will go for the Instruction Phase?, what you have written is important and helps people understand about all the Legal aspect of the Case before it goes to the Judges or Jury, can this be saved anywhere so people can refer to it.

8 – If the MP decides to lay charges (if enough INDICATIONS have been collected), then:

9 – The INSTRUCTION PHASE begins. This phase is OPTIONAL. The arguido has to request it. If not, it goes directly to trial.

10 – The instruction phase is LED by the instruction judge (vs. 'overseen' as in the inquiry phase).

Katey


I'd say it is VERY VERY likely that they would request the beginning of the instruction phase. Especially taking into consideration all that has been said about them wanting for Jane, Joe and Zoe to be interviewed.

Also bear in mind that the use of character witnesses is VERY restricted.



I agree with you 100%, SS. I don't think this lot are about getting things over with as quickly as possible, probably because they fear the outcome. I think they will try to stretch the whole process out any way they can.

Thank you, thank you, thank you for this thread!!!!! It is soooo helpful in determining what happens next. I was somewhat familiar with civil law systems before, but this clarifies things beautifully.
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Re: 21 steps to trial

Postby writer lynn » Tue Apr 29, 2008 7:44 pm

12 – Both the MP and the arguido can assist to ALL instructory acts. They can also request any explanations or ask to the judge to ask any questions they find necessary to discover the truth, including calling witnesses or requiring further diligences. The judge can delegate some of this diligences in the PJ. Remember that even those performed by the PJ can be assisted by the arguido.
-------------------

It has been reported that the McCanns have given a whole list of witnesses they 'want' questioned. Most of us thought this arrogant at best, but supposing they did this because they are already at the instructory stage? Can they have already been charged? Or have i misunderstood the process?
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Re: 21 steps to trial

Postby writer lynn » Tue Apr 29, 2008 7:48 pm

12 – Both the MP and the arguido can assist to ALL instructory acts. They can also request any explanations or ask to the judge to ask any questions they find necessary to discover the truth, including calling witnesses or requiring further diligences. The judge can delegate some of this diligences in the PJ. Remember that even those performed by the PJ can be assisted by the arguido.
-------------------

It has been reported that the McCanns have given a whole list of witnesses they 'want' questioned. Most of us thought this arrogant at best, but supposing they did this because they are already at the instructory stage? Can they have already been charged? Or have i misunderstood the process?
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Re: 21 steps to trial

Postby newperson » Tue Apr 29, 2008 8:24 pm

who would the prosecution lawyer be? or would it be public prosecutor on his own? excuse my ignorance

:oops:

i mean who would be as good as their lawyers arepurported to be
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Re: 21 steps to trial

Postby scylla » Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:15 am

It's immensely helpful to see it all laid out like that. Thanks SS.
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Re: 21 steps to trial

Postby mickahoine » Wed Apr 30, 2008 8:26 am

thank you soooo much for the list of "21".
understand a hell of a lot clearer now.
enjoy your w/end.
bump!
:) :D :bounce: :bounce: :salute: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:

don't feed the trolls.
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Re: 21 steps to trial

Postby StinkySardine » Wed Apr 30, 2008 9:11 am

writer lynn wrote:12 – Both the MP and the arguido can assist to ALL instructory acts. They can also request any explanations or ask to the judge to ask any questions they find necessary to discover the truth, including calling witnesses or requiring further diligences. The judge can delegate some of this diligences in the PJ. Remember that even those performed by the PJ can be assisted by the arguido.
-------------------

It has been reported that the McCanns have given a whole list of witnesses they 'want' questioned. Most of us thought this arrogant at best, but supposing they did this because they are already at the instructory stage? Can they have already been charged? Or have i misunderstood the process?


That's basically media spin. The whole thing is still in the inquiry phase and under secrecy of justice. Saying they 'want' is just pressure. At this stage they cannot want anything. The MP can, however, reading all that cr*p find a good idea and take the initiative to talk to someone that is included in the 'I want' list.

It is natural that both defense and prosecution/investigation teams find a lot of common ground on the people they want to be interviewed...

They are not at the instructory phase. We would know it! For that charges would have been brought.
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Re: 21 steps to trial

Postby StinkySardine » Wed Apr 30, 2008 9:14 am

newperson wrote:who would the prosecution lawyer be? or would it be public prosecutor on his own? excuse my ignorance

:oops:

i mean who would be as good as their lawyers arepurported to be


Public prosecutor. In some instances, the 'injured' party can be part of the prosecution in the figure of 'assistant'. Don't confuse this term with a regular assistant, it's just that the portuguese terminology is not very fortunate when translated. See the 'assistant' as a legally interested party (usually the victim a public crime). This will not be the case, though.
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Re: 21 steps to trial

Postby pear » Wed Apr 30, 2008 10:37 am

StinkySardine wrote:
newperson wrote:who would the prosecution lawyer be? or would it be public prosecutor on his own? excuse my ignorance

:oops:

i mean who would be as good as their lawyers arepurported to be


Public prosecutor. In some instances, the 'injured' party can be part of the prosecution in the figure of 'assistant'. Don't confuse this term with a regular assistant, it's just that the portuguese terminology is not very fortunate when translated. See the 'assistant' as a legally interested party (usually the victim a public crime). This will not be the case, though.


As far as I know they asked for it, though, just before they were arguidified, to stress their quality of "victims of a crime" as parents of Madeleine. It was refused, of course. it was YoungChicken just being lawyerly :D
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Re: 21 steps to trial

Postby Shrike » Wed Apr 30, 2008 6:49 pm

Who are Jane, Joe and Zoe?
'We know our facts, we know what we did.' Gerry McCann

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Re: 21 steps to trial

Postby StinkySardine » Fri May 02, 2008 8:57 am

Shrike wrote:Who are Jane, Joe and Zoe?


Nobody, really. Such a way of saying they want a whole bunch of people to be interviewed. The Jane was not very well chosen, I reckon.
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Re: 21 steps to trial

Postby mickey1 » Fri May 02, 2008 3:20 pm

Are we getting any nearer yet, Sardine?? [it seems somehow rude to call you Stinky]
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Re: 21 steps to trial

Postby StinkySardine » Fri May 02, 2008 3:46 pm

mickey1 wrote:Are we getting any nearer yet, Sardine?? [it seems somehow rude to call you Stinky]


Well, Mickey1,

There are time limits for each phase. So, one way or the other the MP will get to the end of this one. Whether or not the next one will begin is the million dollar question!

PS - Don't worry about the Stinky thingy :wink:
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Re: 21 steps to trial

Postby mickey1 » Fri May 02, 2008 5:40 pm

StinkySardine wrote:
mickey1 wrote:Are we getting any nearer yet, Sardine?? [it seems somehow rude to call you Stinky]


Well, Mickey1,

There are time limits for each phase. So, one way or the other the MP will get to the end of this one. Whether or not the next one will begin is the million dollar question!

PS - Don't worry about the Stinky thingy :wink:


OK thanks Fragrant Flying Fish :lol:
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Re: 21 steps to trial

Postby StinkySardine » Fri May 02, 2008 5:46 pm

:lol: :lol:

(with the small caveat that sardines don't jump out of the water... but who cares?)
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